For decades, researchers and psychologists have recognized that the levels of “insistence and persistence” of gender dysphoria in children are important factors to measure. These experts have identified what most wise people instinctively know: there is a difference between a child’s temporary (and entirely appropriate) self-identification as a cat or Batman, and an extended commitment to a belief, identity, or activity, such as a child who practices basketball alone everyday past dusk for years.
My daughter has done her coming out bit, though I noticed that one of her closest friends still calls her by her birth name. Also, while I thought she had desisted, during this period of "silence," she had gone deeper into the ideology. The school here accepted it wholly without informing us, and the school counselor sent her to the local LGBTQ shelter, where she was further brainwashed and love-bombed.
The man there, an adult who should know better, but is paid by the city to run the place, obviously gave her a "test" at some time that suggested she was close to suicide, the usual hook to turn us into glitter parents. It didn't, because I saw the test and I pointed out to him that had I done that test between the ages of 13 and 20, I, too, would have been close to suicide. It was some infantile thing full of very crude suggestions.
I actually went there to talk to him (my daughter wanted me to), and what I discovered was a fellow trained in manipulative techniques, very basic ones but they were in place, who obviously wanted to paint us parents in the blackest light possible so that our daughter would have to fall upon the shelter for "shelter".... If that wasn't a form of grooming, I don't know what is. After nearly 2 hours, he realized he'd hit upon a a parent who was not going to let himself be pushed around by some 4th-rate culty behavior.... At one point he said that my way of thinking would suggest that I'd prefer if my kid committed suicide. ...
I wrote him an "aide-mémoire" that got him really excited, he then shared it and parts of our conversation (selectively) to other adults at the center (probably trying to pry my daughter away by law, because the government here fell for that crap, hook, line, and sinker). So I turned my correspondence with him over to my daughter, who was not happy, but transparency is key. She knows I will fight for her sanity, for her well-being. My daughter is clearly on the autism spectrum, btw, she is highly intelligent, and that could be the problem. She starts toying with ideas that rapidly become obsession.
Anyway.... The struggle goes on. I can't say I am not deeply fearful of what might happen. I am overworked (underpaid as well), but I may see some time coming where I interview surgeons about the insane idea of mutilating the bodies of healthy kids based on some postmodern claptrap. My doctor is a very open person, he'll get me the interviewees. And at some point I am going to go to the school counselor and have a gentle conversation. Dad is also autistic, apparently, and when I bite, you have to kill me to open my jaws.
Thank you for this. As the parent of a 22 year of trans-identifying, medicalized daughter, I'd like to suggest some further refinement, if only to assuage my rising level of panic. The highest stage here lumps persons who have started cross-sex hormones with those who have had double mastectomies, hysterectomies and legal name changes - all the later are defcon 5 IMHO. I'd like to hope that my daughter can go off the T and have a good chance of getting her life back. That becomes increasing difficult with surgeries and change of legal status. So maybe we need 3 more stages - drugs, surgery, legal. Again, this may only make me feel better but I'll take it.
I wonder how helpful this is. It pretends that this is unidirectional when many of us parents have seen kids move back and forth between different stages. As someone with cancer diagnoses in their immediate family, I both appreciate and dislike The metaphor of illness and also that stage four is somehow terminal. Where do the disasters and detransitioners go? I suggest a circle! Or perhaps a spiral.
We have had a couple times that we saw evidence that our daughter was desisting only to have her double down harder when stress happened in her life. I’ve noticed that she uses the transmovement to help her cope with anxiety. I believe her to be an undiagnosed high functioning autistic girl. As far as I can get the therapist to look is a test for ADD which the results of the test concluded her to be. I think that is a misdiagnosis though. I wish that therapists really understood or studied other research besides WPATH which is highly flawed. The fact they don’t recognize ROGD and want to push the trans ideology is frustrating
Donna M., have you spoken to Lisa Littman? Having run two studies, she's the best expert we have on ROGD. Perhaps you two could collaborate on a third.
In reference to opposite sex clothing, I would suggest that clothing inherently is not sex-based. Women wear trousers and T-shirts and men do wear skirts or dresses. In the descriptors, it may be helpful to qualify the statements with the term “clothes which are considered traditionally to be masculine or feminine,” or something like that. I never consider my clothes to be such but that, again, is the problem with gender. Toys and clothes and behaviors are only considered “masculine” or “feminine” because of training in a patriarchal society, not because that are innately intended for males or females. We are human first and then male or female and then we decide on the socially constructed multiple gender expressions available to us. Once you have decided to freely express yourself in some fashion, there is no need to think of yourself as masculine or feminine, you are simply you and allowing your own personality to be expressed through dress or behavior, etc.
My daughter has done her coming out bit, though I noticed that one of her closest friends still calls her by her birth name. Also, while I thought she had desisted, during this period of "silence," she had gone deeper into the ideology. The school here accepted it wholly without informing us, and the school counselor sent her to the local LGBTQ shelter, where she was further brainwashed and love-bombed.
The man there, an adult who should know better, but is paid by the city to run the place, obviously gave her a "test" at some time that suggested she was close to suicide, the usual hook to turn us into glitter parents. It didn't, because I saw the test and I pointed out to him that had I done that test between the ages of 13 and 20, I, too, would have been close to suicide. It was some infantile thing full of very crude suggestions.
I actually went there to talk to him (my daughter wanted me to), and what I discovered was a fellow trained in manipulative techniques, very basic ones but they were in place, who obviously wanted to paint us parents in the blackest light possible so that our daughter would have to fall upon the shelter for "shelter".... If that wasn't a form of grooming, I don't know what is. After nearly 2 hours, he realized he'd hit upon a a parent who was not going to let himself be pushed around by some 4th-rate culty behavior.... At one point he said that my way of thinking would suggest that I'd prefer if my kid committed suicide. ...
I wrote him an "aide-mémoire" that got him really excited, he then shared it and parts of our conversation (selectively) to other adults at the center (probably trying to pry my daughter away by law, because the government here fell for that crap, hook, line, and sinker). So I turned my correspondence with him over to my daughter, who was not happy, but transparency is key. She knows I will fight for her sanity, for her well-being. My daughter is clearly on the autism spectrum, btw, she is highly intelligent, and that could be the problem. She starts toying with ideas that rapidly become obsession.
Anyway.... The struggle goes on. I can't say I am not deeply fearful of what might happen. I am overworked (underpaid as well), but I may see some time coming where I interview surgeons about the insane idea of mutilating the bodies of healthy kids based on some postmodern claptrap. My doctor is a very open person, he'll get me the interviewees. And at some point I am going to go to the school counselor and have a gentle conversation. Dad is also autistic, apparently, and when I bite, you have to kill me to open my jaws.
This is a good start.
Thank you for this. As the parent of a 22 year of trans-identifying, medicalized daughter, I'd like to suggest some further refinement, if only to assuage my rising level of panic. The highest stage here lumps persons who have started cross-sex hormones with those who have had double mastectomies, hysterectomies and legal name changes - all the later are defcon 5 IMHO. I'd like to hope that my daughter can go off the T and have a good chance of getting her life back. That becomes increasing difficult with surgeries and change of legal status. So maybe we need 3 more stages - drugs, surgery, legal. Again, this may only make me feel better but I'll take it.
Very insightful
I wonder how helpful this is. It pretends that this is unidirectional when many of us parents have seen kids move back and forth between different stages. As someone with cancer diagnoses in their immediate family, I both appreciate and dislike The metaphor of illness and also that stage four is somehow terminal. Where do the disasters and detransitioners go? I suggest a circle! Or perhaps a spiral.
We have had a couple times that we saw evidence that our daughter was desisting only to have her double down harder when stress happened in her life. I’ve noticed that she uses the transmovement to help her cope with anxiety. I believe her to be an undiagnosed high functioning autistic girl. As far as I can get the therapist to look is a test for ADD which the results of the test concluded her to be. I think that is a misdiagnosis though. I wish that therapists really understood or studied other research besides WPATH which is highly flawed. The fact they don’t recognize ROGD and want to push the trans ideology is frustrating
The Stages… what an incredibly helpful barometer!
Donna M., have you spoken to Lisa Littman? Having run two studies, she's the best expert we have on ROGD. Perhaps you two could collaborate on a third.
Brilliant idea
In reference to opposite sex clothing, I would suggest that clothing inherently is not sex-based. Women wear trousers and T-shirts and men do wear skirts or dresses. In the descriptors, it may be helpful to qualify the statements with the term “clothes which are considered traditionally to be masculine or feminine,” or something like that. I never consider my clothes to be such but that, again, is the problem with gender. Toys and clothes and behaviors are only considered “masculine” or “feminine” because of training in a patriarchal society, not because that are innately intended for males or females. We are human first and then male or female and then we decide on the socially constructed multiple gender expressions available to us. Once you have decided to freely express yourself in some fashion, there is no need to think of yourself as masculine or feminine, you are simply you and allowing your own personality to be expressed through dress or behavior, etc.